MNFRED JAHN'S DC3 C47 FOR P3D

[shermank]

This has been my go too plane for years and I genuinely love flying it. However, I have never been happy with its climbing to altitude. I have taken steps to load fuel and passenger loads without much difference. I am careful about leaning fuel above 3500 feet. However, when I am nearing or above 10000 feet, torque begins to die and I simply cannot execute a proper climb.
Using trim will almost always guarantee an unsatisfactory AOA.
So, I am looking for tips, perhaps something in aircraft.cfg or other operational tips. However, do think I have read them all, and have never been able to satisfactorily improve the plane's climb.
Thanks for any tips.
Sherm

[JorgenSA]

Sherm,

Maybe Manfred himself could give you some tips. Or you might want to ask the friendly folks at AIG or MAIW on how to do this?

Jorgen

[bullfox]

I have this airplane ported over to P3D6 with no problem. After reading this post I googled "DC3 rate of climb" You can find the climb settings and expected rate of climb. Give it a look. The DC3 is not a sky rocket but the rate of climb is not too bad. I will have to try it again but my recollection is that initially it climbs easily when not overloaded at 1000 fpm but quickly deteriorates. Once you get up to 10,000 ft or so you are normally climbing at around 500 fpm. Its my recollection that Jann's DC3 has carbonated, un supercharged engines.

[JorgenSA]

Bullfox, allow me a quote: "The DC3 is not a sky rocket".

From personal experience, having jumped from those in RDAF service about 30 times, I can definitely verify that! Twice I also have had the pleasure of flying one, under the watchful eye of an IP.

But it's such a nice, docile old bird...

Jorgen

[shermank]

thanks for your suggestions and ideas. I have registered at MAIW. Unfortunately their website is in a state of transition as it is under reconstruction and I am unable to post anything.
I like the idea of contacting Manfred, but do not know how to reach him. Any advice is appreciated.
One more request...if any of you have the aircraft.cfg, I am very grateful for a copy that includes the proper power and related settings.
Thanks everyone.
BTW, I am aware of the power and climb limitations of the aircraft. I normally climb at 500 fpm, which is the rated climb.
Again, thanks.
Sherm

[JorgenSA]

Sherm,

I am able to post at MAIW, but I have been registered there for years. Their site has been under severe malware attacks, that's why they're repairing it now. Their file library is unavailable because of this, and will be for a while yet.

Jorgen

[shermank]

Thanks Jorgen,

At least I was able to register.

Do you know how to reach Manfred?

Sherm

[JorgenSA]

I believe you can actually do that in the FSX forums on flightsim.com, here:

https://www.flightsim.com/forums/forum/ ... iscussion/

I cannot remember if there is a way of contacting him in the readmes of his aircraft.

Jorgen

[Martyson]

This has been my go too plane for years and I genuinely love flying it. However, I have never been happy with its climbing to altitude. I have taken steps to load fuel and passenger loads without much difference. I am careful about leaning fuel above 3500 feet. However, when I am nearing or above 10000 feet, torque begins to die and I simply cannot execute a proper climb.
Using trim will almost always guarantee an unsatisfactory AOA.
So, I am looking for tips, perhaps something in aircraft.cfg or other operational tips. However, do think I have read them all, and have never been able to satisfactorily improve the plane's climb.
Thanks for any tips.
Sherm

Hi shermank,


I tested the C-47 (freeware Beta product in Xplane11)

I was doing some pre flights with the Xplane11 CRJ200 (by JRollon) so took a break to have a quick look at Manfred Jahn’s C-47 performance there.

Is this basically what you expected to see on your test flights in P3D?
Or, were you expecting better performance than my quick test here?

Not at MTOW for departure.
Did not do much trimming.

12000 feet (screenshot).
Pitch trim 12000 feet (screenshot).
16000 feet screenshot.

17000 feet in 16 minutes.

At 18000 feet the climb had just reached 500 feet per minute.

I took some screenshots.

Credits:
This C-47 v3.2.1 is an X-Plane project by Aeroworx:
Johan van Wyk
Frederick Stegmann

Original P3D/FSX:
Jan Visser (VVC models and textures)
Manfred Jahn (external models, additional coding, bug fixing, checklist and Monitor Panel)
Phil Hopkins (Original P3D/FSX documentation)

[shermank]

Thanks Martyson,

I should have put two and two together. Johann flies regularly with me and about a dozen others on MP flights at DC3 Airways. In fact, I just finished a flight about half an hour ago. Fred flies sometimes, but I think he is limited by health issues.

But, I will reach out to Johann for some specific advice. He is usually very generous with his knowledge.
Again thanks, and also for the reference notes. I have shut down my sim program for the day, but will do some testing tomorrow.

Sherm

[bullfox]

Here is a image of Manfred Jahn's DC3/C47 at 9700 ft. altitude on a flight from KMFR to KRDD. I am posting this image becasue this is the only aircraft skin that actually looks shiny instead of grey. I have 15 skins for this airplane and this is the only one that has some reflectivity.

Anyway, I made some changes in the aircraft config file to make it faster. I lowered the induced drag factor from 1.3 to 9 and raised the propeller efficiency from 1.5 to 1.6. As general way of doing business I mess with the config files to make every aircraft faster.

So this is at 9700 feet with MP of 29 inches, rpm 2500, and auto rich. We are climbing at 600 fpm and 140kts or 161mph. I am not much help for anybody who is trying to fly according to specs. The config file shows the engines are turbocharged, but I don't remember if I made that change myself, but I kinda sorta think I did.

This is in the latest version of P3D6. I think at altitude its a little too blue on the ground and I've been trying to tone that down a bit. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

[shermank]

Thanks bullFox. I will make those config changes and report back. I know that some of our people think the map should be in the range of 30-32 Inches at cruising speeds. I have never been able to reach that range and maintain cruising…

Sherm.

[bullfox]

If you cannot maintain 30 inches of manifold pressure at 10,000 feet you are not supercharged.

[shermank]

If you cannot maintain 30 inches of manifold pressure at 10,000 feet you are not supercharged.

My understanding is that the model I am flying is not supercharged. As for your suggested changes, I did change efficiency to 1.6. But, your suggestion to change drag to 9 did not allow me to gain enough runway speed to take off. So, I did not make that change. Might there have been a typo with that recommendation.

Otherwise, I completed a flight a few minutes ago from KSBA to KSFO, climbing to 14,500 without difficulty. I probably could have gone higher...will test that on another flight.

I reread the plane's readme.txt and noticed that Nick Cooper is one of those involved in its testing. In fact, I know Nick personally and will contact him for his specific recommendations.
Thanks for leading me onto the right path. I appreciate all your time and effort.
Sherm

[bullfox]

Induced drag becomes less of an issue as airspeed increases. The wing of a DC3 has an aspect ratio of 9.17 which is a bit higher than a lot of airplanes. I therefore thought that 1.3 was too high. However, one of us forgot the decimal point. It should be .9, not 9.