Massive Performance Hit - Undocked panels

[Rob McCarthy]

There is a known issue with the text menu causing a small freeze when opening. This is something we're currently looking into. Are you only seeing a slow down when undocking PMDG aircraft panels or do you see this in default vehicles as well?

Regards,
Rob McCarthy

[branks737]

Hi Rob,

From my experience, yes this is occurring with default aircraft panels/gauges aswell as third party ones.

Strangely enough what I was now able to confirm is that once I undocked a gauge the first time, my FPS halved. Then if I undocked the same gauge again I would only loose like 1-2 FPS. If I undock a different gauge, FPS halved.

So it appears once I undock a gauge once, any subsequent time I undock the same gauge, I don't drop in FPS (this is for third party and default aircraft). As I mentioned in previous posts, this is also occurring in text menu pop ups (default and third party). This known text menu freeze you speak of is exactly how I would describe the panels/gauge undocking issue. The big drop in FPS causes a short freeze then it goes back to stable FPS.

Regards

Branko

[rockliffe]

Thanks for posting the additional info. Do you notice any framerate changes when you first undock the panel or only after moving it to the secondary monitor? Also after closing the panel window does activating another application and then going back to Prepar3D bring the framerate back up? Does right-clicking the main screen make any difference as well?

Regards,
Rob McCarthy

Ideas Rob?

[Rob McCarthy]

We'll investigate this more and get back to you.

Regards,
Rob McCarthy

[rockliffe]

Thanks Rob. I really hope this can be rectified, as it has destroyed my ability to operate a load of extras on a separate monitor that is something I have been able to do since starting simming 7 years ago! It also prevents even opening a panel within the main sim monitor too! Thanks for your support with this and I look forward to hearing from you.

[rockliffe]

We'll investigate this more and get back to you.

Regards,
Rob McCarthy

I have been doing some further testing. It appears, for example, using the A2A or PMDG NGX either the GPS panel or the CDU from the 737, that they can be opened onto the main monitor and while they are 'undocked' there is a big fps hit, about 30/40%. However, if they are 'docked' then the framerate returns to normal. The problem arises when I try to drag the panel to the second monitor, as to achieve this it is necessary to 'undock' the panel. I thought the simple answer would be to then 'dock' the window when dragged to the new position on the second monitor. Sadly this does not work, as when I click to 'dock' the panel, there is an option to do so by clicking on a tab which reads 'On-board Chaseplane)-View 00. I have no idea what this means, but when clicked, in the hope that it will dock the panel, it does so by returning it to the main monitor! Have you got any closer to sorting this rob? Cheers.

[rockliffe]

We'll investigate this more and get back to you.

Regards,
Rob McCarthy

Rob, this was posted by Beau Hollis regarding this issue 14th January 2014. He wrote:

We found and fixed this issue (and a few others in the process). The main 3d window renders and then waits to flip until after the simulation is done processing the next fame. This give the GPU time to process the draw calls, allowing the CPU and GPU to keep working as much as possible. Un-docked windows were requesting the back-buffer present/flip immediately after they finished rendering which slowed down undocked 3d views and slowed down the whole system if any un-docked views happen to render after the main app window. The order windows render depended on the monitor they were on. I've gone through and made sure that all undocked windows render first, and also moved the flip requests for all windows to the same place in the frame to maximize CPU/GPU usage. Note that the CPU still appears busy when it blocks on a flip/present call, so some of the performance metrics gathered with process monitors may be a bit skewed in situations like this. This was also likely the cause of the FPS drops when using the menu because we put the content menu in a re-styled undocked window which used to render last.

It's gobbledeegook to me! Any ideas?

[Rob McCarthy]

There were similar issues found in the past caused by window focus issues. Undocked windows were still treated as active instead of the main display causing framerate slowdowns in some cases. These were fixed awhile back and we haven't seen any similar issues since then. We still have this on our radar and will dig into it.

Regards,
Rob McCarthy

[rockliffe]

There were similar issues found in the past caused by window focus issues. Undocked windows were still treated as active instead of the main display causing framerate slowdowns in some cases. These were fixed awhile back and we haven't seen any similar issues since then. We still have this on our radar and will dig into it.

Regards,
Rob McCarthy

Thanks for the update Rob. I'll look forward to a positive solution to this. Thanks.

[Martyson]

No FPS problems to report ( I lock my FPS at 20).

All OK here with FSX, P3Dv3 (newest version), P3dv4 HF1 , Win7-64, windowed mode, two monitors, all aircraft including PMDG737/777 and payware scenery, saved flights, new flights and tutor flights.

All these on my second monitor: ActiveSky (Next or AS16 for P3Dv3 / P3dv4), PFPX, PROatcX, PMDG pilot's CDU (undocked), EXdok.
Note: for PMDG my first Officer's displays are disabled.


I do not use Trackir or ChasePlane.


MyPC-Specs

Win7-PRO-64
Gigabyte Z170 motherboard
i7 6700- 4GHz LGA 1151 8MB cache CPU (4 Cores 8 Threads) No overclock , water cooled.
16GB DDR4 Memory
500GB SSD Boot drive C (Crucial by Micron CT500 MX200 SSD)
2TB ST200 DM SCSI Hard drive F
GEForce GT 960 4GB Video card
Audigy SE Sound Card
750W Power supply
Antec Tower case
Blu-Ray RW CD LG BD-RE drive D
ViewSonic VX2250WM-LED 22-Inch (21.5-Inch Vis) Widescreen Full HD 1080p LED Monitor with Integrated Stereo Speakers
ViewSonic VX2250WM-LED 22-Inch (21.5-Inch Vis) Widescreen Full HD 1080p LED Monitor with Integrated Stereo Speakers
Insignia Tablet (NS-P10A710 FLEX 10.1" ANDROID TABLET) mostly for Remote CDU usage or charts.

Nvidia 385.41 6-8-2017
FSUIPC4 registered v4-971
FSUIPC registered v5.121a

[rockliffe]

edit

[rockliffe]

No FPS problems to report ( I lock my FPS at 20).

All OK here with FSX, P3Dv3 (newest version), P3dv4 HF1 , Win7-64, windowed mode, two monitors, all aircraft including PMDG737/777 and payware scenery, saved flights, new flights and tutor flights.

All these on my second monitor: ActiveSky (Next or AS16 for P3Dv3 / P3dv4), PFPX, PROatcX, PMDG pilot's CDU (undocked), EXdok.
Note: for PMDG my first Officer's displays are disabled.


I do not use Trackir or ChasePlane.


MyPC-Specs

Win7-PRO-64
Gigabyte Z170 motherboard
i7 6700- 4GHz LGA 1151 8MB cache CPU (4 Cores 8 Threads) No overclock , water cooled.
16GB DDR4 Memory
500GB SSD Boot drive C (Crucial by Micron CT500 MX200 SSD)
2TB ST200 DM SCSI Hard drive F
GEForce GT 960 4GB Video card
Audigy SE Sound Card
750W Power supply
Antec Tower case
Blu-Ray RW CD LG BD-RE drive D
ViewSonic VX2250WM-LED 22-Inch (21.5-Inch Vis) Widescreen Full HD 1080p LED Monitor with Integrated Stereo Speakers
ViewSonic VX2250WM-LED 22-Inch (21.5-Inch Vis) Widescreen Full HD 1080p LED Monitor with Integrated Stereo Speakers
Insignia Tablet (NS-P10A710 FLEX 10.1" ANDROID TABLET) mostly for Remote CDU usage or charts.

Nvidia 385.41 6-8-2017
FSUIPC4 registered v4-971
FSUIPC registered v5.121a

Hi Vaughan, if you have your frames locked at 20, then that is the reason why you see no difference. Cheers.

[Martyson]

"Hi Vaughan, if you have your frames locked at 20, then that is the reason why you see no difference. Cheers."

What I see on my setup is no performance problems.

[farman]

Hi, may I intrude? I made several tests with the same parameters - airplane, weather (AS4+REX Enhanced), locations -, and I can say that in my case the issue of a dramatic loss of FPS is the undocked windows (from 30 to 10/15). In the former version (v4), I used to fly with undocked GPS and APé on a second screen;now, I must fly with these windows in the main monitor.
Hope there'll be sonn a hotfix to fix this annoying issue.
regards,
Fulvio Arman

[rockliffe]

Hi, may I intrude? I made several tests with the same parameters - airplane, weather (AS4+REX Enhanced), locations -, and I can say that in my case the issue of a dramatic loss of FPS is the undocked windows (from 30 to 10/15). In the former version (v4), I used to fly with undocked GPS and APé on a second screen;now, I must fly with these windows in the main monitor.
Hope there'll be sonn a hotfix to fix this annoying issue.
regards,
Fulvio Arman

I too am very disappointed with this Fulvio. It ha sbecome quite a big deal for me. I would have the GPS, Active Sky, VoxATC FS2Crew and other bits on a second monitor and have flown this way for the past six or seven years. Now to find I cannot do this is extremely disappointing.